Death of Conservatism?

Conservative values have been visibility pushed back (for better or for worse) over the years, from the Renaissance to the rise of socialism in Western nations. No country is getting more conservative as a general trend. Is conservatism "losing" to liberalism, or does conservatism naturally have to compromise? (Conservatism naturally compromising as in that the ultimate goal of conservatism is a unchanging society, and unchanging society is inevitable.)

Random Stranger: I think one of the reasons for the decline of conservativism is their overall refusal to move forward with time and their refusal to compromise.

Case in point: The Republican Party in the United States. Once a great party, they are now the party that has embraced an alt-right candidate, has fought progress tooth and nail, and refuses to even acknowledge that Climate Change is real and is a threat.

Random Stranger: It is because of progressivism and the rise of globalization and cultural utilitarianism (something I thought of).
Inevitably, societal conditions change overtime, that is progressivism.

Random Stranger: Well duh. What's conservatism to conserve? Society is not stagnant forever, much as conservatives try to keep the old ways. Inherently over time, conservatism has to make room for new ideas.

Likewise progressivism is always changing to the next item of progress. One could say 1800s progressivism has been pushed back.

Random Stranger: I will respond by point.
Conservative values have been visibility pushed back (for better or for worse)
What conservative principles are you referring to? U.S. conservatism?
from the Renaissance to the rise of socialism in Western nations.
Really? Capitalism dominates the west and modern academics. They are social democratic, but not socialist.
No country is getting more conservative as a general trend.
Yeah, it is progressivism.
Is conservatism "losing" to liberalism, or does conservatism naturally have to compromise?
What do you mean by "liberalism"? Probably social liberalism, which dominates because of the modern tendencies.

Conservatism is the metaphorical shadow to liberalism's light (I'm not saying liberalism is necessarily better); as long as liberals find new causes to champion, there will be people who are vehemently opposed to that change.

Bi0Hazard: @admin Think of the Native Americans. Their society was virtually unchanged for thousands of years until the Europeans came along. So, it is somewhat possible for a culture to "freeze."

I still agree that conservatism can't really succeed in permanently stopping change in society, especially with globalization, but I don't think that it is impossible.

Random Stranger: When Columbus came to North America did he find small bands of hunter gatherers as crossed the Bering Sea over 10,000 years prior? Of course not. Their society had evolved.

Look at the differences between Mayan and Aztec culture. They're substantial! It just looks similar given our western mindset.

I think societies progress slower when they're relatively isolated. The pacific islands are a good example. @nzlockie always also shared the theory that societies with little reason for resource conflict (ie fertile places) will progress slower, which makes a lot of sense. However there were many places in pre-Columbus America where this was not the case.

From a certain vantage point there might seem to be little difference between Europe in the 1100s and the 1300s. But there were, of course, huge changes in this time. Still be careful not to confuse slow change for no change.

Random Stranger: @admin provided a good explanation for your point.

Societies have progressed overtime, which supports progressivism. Conservatism holds to a unchanging society, which is inconsistent with the history of human society.
At a time, U.S. conservatives were "progressive".

admin: I was thinking more along the lines of Eskimos and Northern American nomadic tribes, which were far less developed than the Mayans or Aztecs, and even they were light-years behind Europe right before their decline - not necessarily technologically, but in the ideas that had barely changed since they had settled in the Americas.

Europe, however, has go through a lot, like starting with Celtic paganism, transitioning to a massive demographic of Christianity, the Protestant Reformation, and today, Atheism. It birthed the idea of democracy, figured out the Earth was round, and created cross-continental trade, all before even coming in contact with the Americas.

I'd agree the isolation causes slower progression. Now days, we can exchange and accept ideas from anywhere, like we are now, and the world is moving pretty fast.

I never said that Native Ameicans had no change. I was pointing out how they had relatively little change to the modern day.

Random Stranger: Which is not necessarily evidence of a conservative ideology.

When the Europeans came into contact with the Maori people in New Zealand for example, they readily adopted European ideas, initially to conquer other Maori tribes, and eventually to fight the Europeans themselves. In the space of just a few years they discovered writing, maths, modern science, modern weapons and so much more. Almost universally they embraced these things, even though they'd been behind the Europeans in other respects. Indeed this readiness to adapt won them a lot of respect.

admin: Yes, when a dramatic improvement in quality of life can be achieved by taking on a foreign culture, many cultures will take it on. Gradual domestic changes around cultures like the Native Americans or Pacific Islanders were few and far between.

I've always wondered if there could be a utopian world where 99% of people would no longer want change. The desire for a better world has sort of become the world pastime, whether it is regarding ethics or scientific breakthroughs.

Random Stranger: Such a world would probably be characterized by relatively little scarcity, little conflict and much isolation.

admin: Yep, and we can pretty much give up on there being a lot of isolation.

Random Stranger: I dunno. Earth might prove to be an isolated place...

"Isolation" has little to do with actual population and more to do with whether you're in contact with people who are actually substantially different from you ie different culture etc.

We may find that we spend a long period of time, prior to meeting with aliens and after uniting somehow, just being content.

Or, we may find that the Earth and our ability to develop new technology does not produce sufficient resources for our needs.

admin: Yes, but the Maoris became just like Westerners, and they lost their native culture.

Dassault Papillon: Lacking technology is not a culture.

In every other respect I'd say that statement is misguided and empirically false. It's a colonial mindset that simply did not hold true.

admin: There are plenty of aspects of Maori culture besides "lacking technology". Whenever they took up Western technology, they also adapted Western cultural norms.

Dassault Papillon: Please share one example.

admin: I don't really know anything about Maori culture, but I'm 99% sure the average Maori lives more or less like a typical white New Zealander does.