Profile of the Edeb8r.

This thread is probably going to offend a lot of people. That is not my intent here; I'm just being brutally and mercilessly honest.

Admin was a DDOer. Stag, a user who was active here until a few days ago, was a DDOer. JMK, a user who appears here occasionally, was a DDOer. I'm currently on good terms with and an active member of both sites, but the first time that I really became active on edeb8 was in the aftermath of some major drama on DDO. Let's not get started with STALIN or RXR. Many of the users described above are or were the backbone of edeb8.
Many of these people have something in common: they proclaim that DDO is a place filled with "immature, drama queen attention whore teenagers" and that it's not a good place for debate because it's too community oriented.
ALL THREE of these people were, during their last days on DDO, the center of large amounts of drama. They got very confrontational with certain members of the DDO community. They have been at some point or another the epitome of drama.

Edeb8 has since its conception served the role of a place where the outcasts of DDO have gone. The core users of edeb8 are looked down upon by the users of DDO. The reason is not because they're edeb8rs but because of the inherent nature of these people. Edeb8 is essentially a magnet for emotionally unstable, perhaps even sociopathic, debaters.

Thoughts?

Dassault Papillon: Quite the opposite - I'd say DDO is a magnet for sociopathic unstable people, since it draws in anyone with an opinion, as opposed to serious formal debaters specifically. Two groups of people come to edeb8 in response to that, if they come from DDO (and this is a minority of users, but a majority of the "more active" group). You can call it fight or flight. Some people fought back against the culture of DDO in their own ways, and such often swiftly fell afoul of the DDO rules. Others, such as myself, have never had any intention to be bullied or to strike back, so I simply walked away. I don't think it's accurate to have ever called my actions "very confrontational" esp. in relation to DDO.

admin: Well, if I recall directly you did get into a fairly nasty presidential debate with Airmax.

Dassault Papillon: That was not nasty. At worst I accused him of neglecting debating, and he accused me of neglecting the community. Politicking stuff. After the election, Airmax made me the chief of tournaments, and everyone else moved on from that. I don't think either of us had a real problem with each other there.

The only issue I've ever had with airmax came significantly later, when he and I got into a dispute over an interpretation of the terms of service for DDO. While I was vindicated, and airmax tried to turn it into something of a scandal by sharing certain details of it with his "council", I've never even talked about it publically beyond these generalities. Sure, airmax upset me then, but I was never nasty towards him. Throughout I always had the utmost respect. Where there has been conflict, I've generally adopted flight over fight.

The meanest thing I've ever said on DDO is that I called imabench and YYW bullies, and that was long after they began attacking me.

Dassault Papillon: Let's examine this...

Many of these people have something in common: they proclaim that DDO is a place filled with "immature, drama queen attention whore teenagers" and that it's not a good place for debate because it's too community oriented.

I'd go even further than that, though it happens to be a true statement.

ALL THREE of these people were, during their last days on DDO, the center of large amounts of drama. They got very confrontational with certain members of the DDO community. They have been at some point or another the epitome of drama.

The second sentence is the link to the remainder of your post, and that's what is especially wrongheaded. I didn't *instigate* any drama, nor did I revel it. That several sanctimonious, anti-intellectual deviants on DDO, several of which have never contributed to the website intellectually in their lives and *only* come for the "social aspect," decided to wage a campaign against me to, I can only surmise, lower the website's collective IQ, wasn't my doing. If you knew anything of my departure, you would have seen that not only did I actively shy away from drama at *multiple* points, but that I walked away in lieu of continuing it, when I had a good mind to tell these low-IQ hypocrites off, especially when one of them (bsh1) had the gall to actually lecture *me* on civility. The irony was considerable.

If that's what being an "outcast" of DDO means, then I'll proudly accept the label. That doesn't in any way make either Lars or me "sociopathic." Rather, I think it suggests that we're simply *above* the drama, and are looking for a civil, intellectual discussion -- the type of discussion Esocialbookworm and cybertron are fundamentally incapable of, because they only visit DDO to socialize and to sheep active, prominent members. Likewise, we don't have a platform, like YYW, to speed hatred and filth and to condescend on things that we *think* we understand.

I'm convinced that if we were to pull the "top 5" on DDO and measure their IQ's relative to the "backbone" of Edeb8, we'd win in a landslide.

Dassault Papillon: I think the operative point here (you're Vox, yes?) is that DDO at present isn't DDO from a year ago -- back when Lars, Stag and I were active members. The website is in crash-and-burn mode, and has been since last year's election season (which I was, conveniently, not around for). Mikal was responsible for the vast majority of that, but no one gave enough of a damn to try to fix it. Rather, they poured their hopes into some panacea that the presidency was supposed to be, but that turned out to be Obama-esque hype (and no one at all should be surprised).

That's why I'm here: I'm not ready to go down with the titanic. The only reason that I visit an online debating website amid my already-wild schedule is to release and to discuss important issues with sensible, intelligent people--two qualities 95% of DDO'ers lack. They're far more interested in puffing out their chests, ceding to seniority, and heralding certain "prominent members" as messiahs, when in reality they're no such thing.

Granted, they have a few promising members left... almost all of them are vastly underestimated, which is sad. Hell, they can't even maintain a damned mafia game without inviting in a crowd of chickens with their heads cut off, who looks as though they'd be better suited for 4chan than a "serious" debating website. I'd tell them to give up and come here, but I *really* don't want to see them pollute this website... so they can keep their hellhole.

Okay then. Please note that I'm not trying to insult you guys.
Just making an observation.

admin: Why exactly did you found edeb8? What happened on DDO immediately prior to you deciding to create edeb8?

Dassault Papillon: I didn't suggest otherwise, but your observation was flawed--and I expect that you anticipated we would correct the record. Rest assured that my animosity isn't directed against you.

DDO is run by physcho-pathic communists. Furthermore is run by an elitist named ''airmax'' who won't ban imabench for some stupid reason. Let's look at imabench's record. Has been suspended MULTIPLE times, bullies his oppenents in debates, and often trolls in the site as well. But still isn't banned, can someone tell me what is so special about that tard ?

Heres proof,

http://www.debate.org/debates/The-US-should-deport-elderly-people-not-illegal-immigrants/1/
http://www.debate.org/debates/Resolved-Black-friday-is-RACIST-AS-SH-T/1/

Dassault Papillon: Immediately prior, nothing happened. I hadn't really even been on DDO for a month beforehand, hadn't done any debates etc. So much so that ClassicRobert kept reaching out to me and asking where I was lol.

I founded edeb8 because I felt the existing offerings for debating weren't really catering to me as a serious debater. During the DDO Dashboard saga, I argued that DDO isn't doing enough for serious debaters, and Imabench said a comment like "well, you're stuck here unless you want to go to CreateDebate". So that gave me the idea to try build a site that IS suited to the more serious debater.

I mean DDO is fine. Its just that I hate arrogant people and Imabench was way too arrogant for me to tolerate. I actually considered DDOsing DDO but then I decided that I might get into trouble. I created another DDO account though.

Bolshevik-: What does "DDOsing" mean?

Dassault Papillon: Many of the users described above are or were the backbone of edeb8.
Many of these people have something in common: they proclaim that DDO is a place filled with "immature, drama queen attention whore teenagers" and that it's not a good place for debate because it's too community oriented.

I think this is pretty correct. Since I live in Trinidad and Tobago, I'll use that as an analogy. DDO is like Trinidad- boisterous, full of bacchanal, and a lot bigger. Edeb8 is like my preferred island, Tobago- quiet, trying to stay out of drama, and peaceful. TBH, if I wasn't an online social butterfly, and truly just wanted to debate, I'd prefer edeb8 because of how serious and a close-knitted small community it is. The only true disadvantage to it, is the small number of people, but when you really look at it- is it a disadvantage? With the small number of good members, good things can be done.

ALL THREE of these people were, during their last days on DDO, the center of large amounts of drama. They got very confrontational with certain members of the DDO community. They have been at some point or another the epitome of drama.


Really, I have no idea what drama admin was associated with, because I've always seen him as an innovative, charming, genuine fella. He didn't like what was going on on DDO, so he decided he wouldn't conform- he made his own site. Standing up to not just a moderator, or company (Juggle), but an ENTIRE website is incredibly admirable. He also seems very non-confrontational. Hell, there's even a warning above the forums (I could be mistaken, I don't frequent the site as much as I should) on what's allowed, and not allowed- for safety of members.

Stag used to be a close friend of mine on DDO. I was always upset with that fiasco with him and Mikal. Jifpop was a great member, in my opinion. Because he was isolated and forever ignored- when he was a good member, was what contributed to him leaving the site, or at least I see it that way.

JMK's drama resulted out of a therapeutic chain of misunderstood events and misinterpretations. The drama surrounding him could have been sorted out a long time ago, had it not been due to users not forgiving and forgetting, or understanding. As many know, we've had our squabbles in the past, but he was one of my first true friends on DDO. I'm sorry he left.

As many know, we've had our squabbles in the past, but he was one of my first true friends on DDO. I'm sorry he left.

I disagree. Edeb8 is a haven, for those ignored, isolated, hurt and serious and strict about debating.

Bolshevik-: Bench and I aren't one another's biggest fans. It's best to just ignore his existence altogether.

Rather, I think it suggests that we're simply *above* the drama, and are looking for a civil, intellectual discussion -- the type of discussion Esocialbookworm and cybertron are fundamentally incapable of, because they only visit DDO to socialize and to sheep active, prominent members.

I'm going to request nicely, that JMK cease bringing me up in any light, such as this in the future. Edeb8 stands up for its members, and is very much against bullying and saying mean things, which I respect a lot. JMK accusing me of being "fundamentally incapable of a civil, intellectual discussion," is mean and uncalled for- since I hadn't even yet entered the thread, nor said anything to him, especially when I've been willing to be civil throughout time- as many can attest.

I'm not sure what Forti just wrote, and I frankly don't care. I blocked her for a reason, and she will forever remain blocked: I neither care about nor value her opinion, and think it would be best if she didn't inject herself into situations like these when clearly her presence does nothing more than stir the pot once again. Some people never learn. The definition of insanity, per our good pal, Einstein, was that insanity is doing the same thing again and again and expecting different results. Take a cue, folks.

I haven't the slightest bit of respect for her, nor do I think that her behavior -- past and present -- or her insistence on opining on things she doesn't understand in order to exonerate her "friends" merits my respect. I will speak freely and candidly about my take on the issue, especially when people (like the OP) have a highly flawed take on what happened, which she -- and bsh1, and cybertron, and plenty of others -- are 100% responsible for. I don't apologize for calling them out. That isn't "bullying"; that's the equivalent of saying that a victim testifying in court, speaking candidly about what happened and confronting the perpetrators, is bullying. She wants me to sugarcoat the past in order to safeguard whatever online persona she's created for herself -- a persona she values more than her so-called "friends." I refuse to be a party to this vitriol and ignorance.

My solution: don't make threads like this if you don't want an honest response. People on DDO didn't understand the definition of the word "candid," i.e., when I said, "if you ask me for my honest opinion of you, I'm going to give you my honest opinion of you." They got pissed off when I gave it to them. Then, when I didn't response, I was berated for *not* giving an "honest criticism." These people are so fundamentally irrational and disconnected from reality that there's just no winning with them. They can drag your name through the mud, making wild allegations -- you're "emotionally unstable," you "brought this upon yourself," you're "on and off the website, and can't make up your damned mind," etc. -- which are just wild allegations rooted in nothing more than they're fundamental lack of understanding, and you're expected to sit quiet and not say a word. Not anymore, not going to happen.

To Forti and all the others: Get off this website and stay out of my way. Stick with your own damn hellhole and stopped stirring the pot further.

when I said, "if you ask me for my honest opinion of you, I'm going to give you my honest opinion of you." They got pissed off when I gave it to them.

Correction: You didn't give me an honest opinion. You told me you wouldn't insult me on the forums.

To Forti and all the others: Get off this website and stay out of my way. Stick with your own damn hellhole and stopped stirring the pot further.

You're not the admin of this website, nor did I do anything wrong. I simply asked that you not use my name in anything you say. It's not nice, and I didn't so anything to you to instigate it here.

Still can't see and, frankly, don't care. Stupidity is what stupidity does; no amount of passive aggression -- from you, from Bsh1, or any of the others -- will change that.

For the record, that was the damned *point.* If you were able to read, you'd see that I wrote this:

hey got pissed off when I gave it to them. Then, when I didn't response, I was berated for *not* giving an "honest criticism."

Cybertron was too much of a moral coward to accept "criticism," so I didn't offer you one--especially when the initial purpose was nothing more than to antagonize me. If I were going to offer you an honest critique, it would look something like this:

You think without acting. You can't think for yourself. You pretend that you know things that you don't, and your opinions and loyalties change with the weather. You're extremely naive and believe almost everything people tell you, even when you've seen time and again those people don't have your best interest at heart. I don't even know who you are anymore, and I don't wish to associate with you again.